(upbeat instrumental music) (triumphant instrumental music) - [Sam] Fellow Spartans, One of the exciting things about the Spartan family is the energy and involvement of our alumni and friends.

A prime example is the Governor Jim Blanchard Public Service Forum, so generously created by former governor, Jim Blanchard and Janet Blanchard.

Their speaker series has brought some of the most inspirational leaders of our time to our campus.

Connecting our students, faculty, and our entire community, with our speakers' life stories and views is an important way we live up to our mission.

Today, you're going to hear directly from Jim Blanchard.

He will share his personal story of over a half century of involvement in American politics, and government, and international affairs.

I know you'll enjoy the program, and thank you for supporting MSU.

Go Green!

- Thank you, President Sam Stanley.

We sincerely appreciate your support for the Blanchard Forum.

You've been a terrific leader at Michigan State University.

You were the right person at the right time.

And we are here today to talk about so many things that are going on in Washington and around the world with my good friend, and former governor, ambassador, Congressman Jim Blanchard.

You also may or may not know that he is a global partner, leading partner, in the firm, DLA Piper.

He's actually on the National Archives Foundation, a member of the board of the Spy Museum.

I could go on forever, Governor.

Even as I introduce you, I know you will want to welcome your fans and supporters who have really been part of this forum, the great forum that you created.

And say hi to all your friends.

And then for those who may not know you, tell them some of the fascinating things that you are doing now to support this forum, and just enjoy work life.

Because we're gonna talk about Joe Biden, and we know you have known him a long time, and are good friends.

But give your people a welcome.

- Well, if I had a full disclosure.

Bob Kolt used to work for me.

He kinda still does.

He's a Professor of Communications at MSU, but has a public relations firm as well, and they are really, really good.

I do wanna welcome everyone, and I wanna thank many of you for supporting our Public Service Forum.

It was created by myself and Janet Blanchard six years ago.

And as some of you know, we've had some fabulous speakers, starting with Bill Clinton, and then Ken Burns, and then Congressman John Lewis, and then the late dear friend of mine, Cokie Roberts, and then Secretary Madeleine Albright.

So we're gonna keep this forum going.

I wanna make sure we make it live.

So in the meantime, we thought we'd have a conversation here with a lot of our friends of the program, friends, and students, faculty, people in the greater MSU community.

And really, I have a lot of friends from outside Michigan watching this, so I've gotta be on my best behavior.

But Bob, thank you.

We're gonna keep the program going, as I said.

But let's get to some questions and dialogue here.

As you know, I've known Joe Biden for 46 years, so.

- Well, let's start there, Governor.

I've been, and you mentioned my name introducing me, I've been at Michigan State University for 28 years in the Department of Advertising and Public Relations College of Communication Arts and Sciences.

I have seen a lot of things in those times, but I don't believe that I've ever seen some of the things that have been happening lately in Washington.

I want you to begin, maybe, with just a big sigh, and a little conversation about what you're seeing now, before we get into some specifics of the Biden administration.

You must admit, we've never seen anything like this.

- That's correct.

Well, 46 years ago, I came to Washington as a young member of Congress with all sorts of hopes and dreams.

By the way, I still have them for our country and for public service.

And when I walked into that Capitol, it was a special feeling.

It's really the cathedral of democracy.

And I always, whenever I'm over there, and I'm over there occasionally, I feel the same thrill to have served there, to work there, to be part of the American experience.

We have reverence for that.

So to see what happened at the Capitol is such a terrible tragedy for anyone who's ever served there, or visited there.

It's really outrageous.

And so there are gonna be consequences to this.

And I don't wanna...

I don't wanna belabor that with this program, 'cause we've had a positive program here at MSU.

There will be consequences.

This interview is occurring as we speak, when the Congress is voting to impeach the president for the second time, and I don't know what the end result will be.

If I were there, I would vote to impeach, by the way.

Some people have emailed that question to me.

I don't know what the result in the Senate will be, but I think it's gonna be a lot more significant than the first impeachment vote.

But we have to look at him, and Joe Biden is the man for this moment.

And we can explore that now, because I have known him for all those 46 years.

He helped elect me in 1974.

- Governor, I do want you to talk for all of the years you served in Congress, and when you saw the video and the action of the Capitol being invaded, you must've had some personal feelings?

- Well, yeah, I mean, I just...

It's tragic.

It's terrible.

Anyone who's ever been there, or served there, just felt like they were violated.

I don't know if any of you saw Nancy Pelosi on "60 Minutes", but you could see she was about to cry during that interview.

Of course, seeing these yahoos propped up at her desk, it's just tragic.

But Bob, I don't wanna belabor this.

I wanna focus on the future.

We have a president who, I think, is gonna do a fabulous job.

He's the perfect president for this moment.

He's worked and waited for this all these 46 years I've known him.

He came in and campaigned for me in 1974 in October.

We were in the backyard of Ralph Gerson, who, at that time, was finishing law school, lived in Huntington Woods with his family.

Ralph wanted to have a fundraiser for me, and he said, "You know, it'd be nice to get...".

He said, "I have a lot of friends and relatives we'd like to contribute to you, but it would be nice to have some sort of outside celebrity come as a special guest".

And so I inquired with the Democratic Congressional Campaign Committee if there was someone that was willing to come in for me, an unknown candidate, outside of our area in Oakland and Macomb County?

And they said, "Well, we have a really young, ambitious Senator, named Joe Biden, and he's indicated he's a little (mumbles) to go around the country and campaign for Democrats".

"He would probably be very good."

And so I said, "That's great".

And so about the middle of October, Joe Biden arrived.

My dear friend, Greg Morris, working on the campaign, picked him up, brought him, took him to the Gerson's backyard.

He came in, he was charming, he was dazzling, he was fit as a fiddle, as he is today, and he gave a very dynamic speech.

We joked about it being a little long, but it was a really good speech.

Everybody really liked him.

I was grateful.

And I knew then that he was a man who wanted to be president.

You know, like myself, he was inspired by President Kennedy.

And then you have Joe Biden's an Irish Catholic, and you had Kennedy.

So he was a man on the move, without a doubt.

Now, if someone had told me those 46 years ago that the future of American democracy would depend on the election of Joe Biden, I would've thought they were crazy.

By the way, I figured Joe would've been president by now, long before now, not 46 years later.

But he's a man for the moment.

He really, really is.

He has experienced the judgment, the energy.

And so here we are!

Janet and I are really looking forward to the inauguration.

We're gonna be there.

I have tickets as a former member of Congress.

So I'm looking to the future, Bob, and the future of our country.

And we're gonna get through all the stuff that we've witnessed tragically, and have a better day.

- As you met Joe Biden those years ago in that first campaign swing that he came in to support you, what was it?

What characteristic was it that Joe Biden had?

He probably was ambitious, but I've just observed that he's always been able to connect with people at any level.

- Oh, yeah, he loves people.

I wrote something, one of the columns, which was, he just doesn't love America, he loves Americans.

He loves people.

I think the two best retail politician I've ever seen are Joe Biden and Bill Clinton.

They just love crowds, love people, like to talk to people.

They also listen to people.

And it was the energy that he conveyed.

He steamed soup.

From what I can tell, you know, brought passion and energy to almost every cause that he works on.

You know, I've stayed in touch with him all those years.

I'm not close, close with Joe Biden.

We're good friends over a 46 year period.

I'm not in his inner circle.

I don't wanna claim any confidential observations, other than he's he's fit as a fiddle physically.

And obviously, today he is so much wiser than all of us were those 46 years ago.

But in the meantime, in Congress, I worked with him on the auto issues.

He was a big supporter of the Chrysler rescue.

We've entertained him in our home when I was governor.

He's been up to Mackinac Island, and he's enjoyed the splendor of our great lakes.

He's had a passion for civil rights, and always empathy for the underdog.

He's been an expert in foreign policy, and also judicial policy.

He was chairman of the Judiciary Committee at one point.

He served with distinction.

Also, the Foreign Affairs Committee.

He knows almost every foreign leader over the last 30 or 40 years around the world.

That's why people were just happy that the current president was defeated.

When Joe Biden got elected, people felt like they knew him all over the world.

They not only danced in the streets in Washington DC and Lansing, they danced in the streets in Paris, and London, and all over the world.

The lovers of democracy know Joe Biden as their friend.

And I will tell you, the average Joe in Michigan knows that Joe is their friend as well.

- Well, Governor, as you were a Congressman, and your career has sort of paralleled with Joe Biden, how did you see him and his ability to work with others over the years, over the decades, as a legislator, before he became vice president?

He was really a go-to guy to get things done, wasn't he?

- Well, he was, and he worked across the aisle, and some on the left have accused him of working across the aisle.

But frankly, in the Senate, that's the only way you get anything done.

So you ended up with a lot of the Republicans really feeling they could trust Joe, and trust his word, and they did, and they do.

That's why John McCain, he and John became close, even though they voted differently on many issues.

You notice, Cindy McCain, John's widow, endorsed Joe, did a commercial in Arizona.

By the way, he was also a good champion for unions and members of the union.

So that really helped us in Michigan with the United Auto Workers, with the teacher's unions.

You know, Joe has a partner, who may be his best adviser, Dr. Jill Biden.

She's a teacher.

She's been teaching in community colleges for many years.

They both have a real affinity for people from average families.

Joe is from Scranton.

Jill is from the Philadelphia area as well.

They're just kind of ordinary people with extraordinary talent.

And I love the fact that Joe Biden has always surrounded himself with talent, with good people.

He is wise enough to hire people who may know something that he doesn't know.

That's a mark of a very strong leader.

Weak leaders hire weak people who play up to them.

Strong leaders hire wise people who can help add value.

Joe has got a great pool of talent around him, including now, the people he's selecting to help manage the White House and serve in his cabinet.

- I wanna talk about some of those people, because you know them well.

But before we get there, go back to the Biden years as vice president.

What stood out?

Was there any defining moment that you can identify, where the nation really saw, this really is Joe Biden, and he's President Barack Obama's right-hand guy?

- Almost like a brother, they say, with President Obama.

Well, I predicted Joe, this is true, and my dear friends know this, I predicted he would be the vice presidential running mate.

I could see what he was running.

And there was no oxygen in the room for Joe, or Chris Dodd, or Bill Richardson.

The oxygen was taken by President Obama and Hillary Clinton.

But after the nomination, Joe was the perfect running mate for Barack Obama, 'cause he had a lot of experience.

Anyone in the Democratic Party knew him and liked him, and he also appealed to blue-collar workers, and to the extent it mattered, Catholics, because Joe is very authentic.

He is the real thing.

He is, indeed, a family man, a practicing Catholic.

Very, very proud of being an Irish Catholic, which, by the way, I think, helped him.

You know, it might've hurt him 50 years ago.

It helped him now, I'll tell you that.

And he's loyal, loyal, loyal.

With President Obama, he not only helped him win the election, but they oversaw the stimulus after our deep, deep recession.

So in that case, with Michigan, he was helping implement the auto rescue, the rescue of Chrysler, and General Motors, and all those suppliers.

I mean, what that did for the jobs in Michigan alone, not to mention Ohio, Indiana, and other places was incredibly important.

In fact, the Michigan unemployment rate during Obama/Biden went from about 13 1/2%, down to about 4 1/2%.

People forget that.

It went down a little bit further under the current president.

But most of the heavy lifting, almost all of it happened during the Obama/Biden administration.

Joe is in the center of that.

He was also helping lead efforts overseas to... And he did, as well as a senator, to end the genocide in the Balkans.

There were so many other things.

He was the emissary to the Senate.

Barack did not have that kind of experience.

So President Obama would send Joe up to the Senate to work on legislation, to get it done.

Work with Mitch McConnell, for that matter.

And also, he was Barack Obama's emissary around the world as well.

Dr. Jill Biden, by the way, and Michelle Obama, worked with veterans families.

Dr. Jill Biden, as I think I mentioned earlier, is also, teaches at the community college in Northern Virginia.

Before that, in Delaware.

So she's big on education and some of it has been special education.

But basically, she's a big advocate for community colleges, for people to get a second chance at life and education, and go on to fulfill both arts jobs, but technical jobs.

So it's a well-balanced family, I must tell you.

But the common thread is, a feeling for people, and enormous energy.

- Well, you know, and he took a bit of a timeout after the passing of his son, Beau, and did not run in 2016.

Many had encouraged him to do that.

Many thought that Joe had retired permanently.

But Charlottesville, according to President Biden, was a defining moment in his return to politics.

Talk a little bit about that, as he reached out to energize a campaign, and then we'll kind of go through a campaign, and a little bit of the election.

- Well, you've mentioned Beau Biden passing away tragically.

You know, he's already lost a daughter and his first wife in an auto accident shortly after he was elected to the Senate.

And so he went through some awful times then.

And then, later, then, of course, losing Joe, who was his pride, or Beau, who was his pride and joy.

So I think a lot of people got to know Joe Biden watching the funeral services, and seeing the grief of the Biden family, and of President Obama, and Michelle Obama, and the bonding that they'd already had earlier.

So that showed Joe, frankly, in his element in the Catholic church with his family, was very, very moving.

And I know we all did when we saw what went on in Charlottesville with neo-Nazis, antisemites, white nationalists.

It really shocked everyone.

And, of course, the reaction of the White House was even more shocking.

And I don't have any doubt that that inspired Joe to wanna run, but I also think there was a candle, there was a flame going in him all these years since he was elected to the Senate in 1972, a flame of, really, ambition, and it, of course, became matched with real talent, and as he got older, real wisdom, which he now has in a way that very few candidates who run for president have at that time.

And I think he just decided, I believe I'm the best, I have the energy to do this, I can surround myself with talented people, and I have the best chance to win.

I think he probably said that to himself.

And I will tell you, when people ask me, all right, why are you endorsing Joe Biden?

I endorsed him immediately.

He announced in April of 2019.

I said, "Several reasons".

"One, I think he'd be a great president."

"And number two, I think he can win."

"Number three, I think he will carry Michigan."

I'm not sure any of the others can win, regardless of their talent.

And I can tell you right now, I'm not sure they could carry Michigan.

And he's a friend of mine- - Why did you think that?

Why did you think that?

(interposing voices) That's important.

What was it about the campaign in 2020 that made you come to that conclusion?

- Real simple, people knew him, they liked him, and they trusted him with power.

Secondarily, he'd been helpful to our autos, and manufacturing, and working people.

Been strong on civil rights.

Had a great affection with the African-American community.

Had been good on women's rights.

And in legislation, as a matter of fact, on women.

And yeah, I just saw him... You don't have to introduce a stranger to people.

The other candidates, so many of them were talented.

Some young, some older.

They could be easily branded by right-wing forces, and demonized before they could even introduce themselves.

Joe didn't have to worry about that.

People liked him.

They trusted him with power, and that is a huge deal when you're running for office, particularly for the highest office.

- And as the campaign went through, there were some bumps, and a lot of candidates, and the COVID-19 sort of took over for the general election campaign.

This was a campaign cycle no one could have possibly predicted, and Joe Biden figured it out, and campaigned in a very effective way with the help of a lot of people, like you, because I know how hard you worked for Joe Biden during that campaign.

- Yes.

Well, I went up to New Hampshire, and New Hampshire is a crazy place.

You know, if you're a celebrity next door, like Bernie Sanders is, or John Kerry was, or Mike Dukakis, you can win a New Hampshire primary, no matter how talented you are from some other place.

So I never expect he would win New Hampshire at all.

But I was up there just to try to do what I could.

But again, between Bernie, and Elizabeth Warren, and others, he wasn't gonna win in New Hampshire.

He did come in like fifth, so that was pretty discouraging.

But I thought, well, hmm, boy, this does not look good.

But the New Hampshire primary voters can be enormously fickle.

If you don't come into their house, and have coffee and donuts, I may not even vote for you.

Well, Joe is a great retail politician, but all the others had been there forever.

But I knew he would carry South Carolina.

The only question was, by how much.

And, of course, the reason is, South Carolina has a very substantial African-American community.

They are loyal Democrats.

And so I knew Joe was running ahead there because of that.

But also, it's a more conservative electorate, too, in terms of the white voters.

But after James Clyburn, the Congressman, endorsed him, as many of you know following this, it was gonna be not only carry South Carolina, but a huge margin.

And once that happened, all the people that we'd been recruiting in Michigan who wanted Biden to win, who wanted to endorse him, but were worried he wasn't gonna be viable when we got to the Michigan primary, there were probably about 40 or 50 key legislators, mayors, party leaders, who told me and others off the record they were for Joe, but he's gotta be alive.

He's gotta win something before they can all go public.

As soon as Joe won South Carolina big time, they all said, "We're all in", and the reason was, they liked him.

They trusted him with power.

They thought he could carry Michigan.

They thought he could connect with all the key audiences in the Democratic Party, and also go on to win.

It was amazing.

And Janet and I hosted a fundraiser for Joe Biden on March 9th.

The primary was the 10th.

We did that with Mayor Duggan, and Edsel and Cynthia Ford.

And Janet was doing all the phoning while I was doing the talking.

Anyway, we didn't have a single person say no, in terms of contributing money.

I've never seen or heard of such of a fundraiser for such a high office, because a lot of those candidates were still in the race.

I mean, Bernie had carried Michigan in the previous primary.

Elizabeth Warren was still in the race.

There were others.

Not a single person said no.

They all wanted to help him.

And it was a wonderful night on March 9th, a Monday night, at the Detroit Athletic Club.

We had about 350 people there.

And then there was a rally at a high school after that.

In the morning, he went to a Chrysler plant.

And that was his last public appearance, in terms of retail politics.

After that, it was the campaign, as you pointed out, waged on Zoom, and limited appearances of limited audiences.

Often, rallies were people in their cars honking their horns.

Nothing like that.

And I thought, oh, what a shame for Joe?

Here's the guy who loves people.

He likes to plunge into crowds.

He's a straight retail politician, and he can't do any of that.

He's just gotta sit there looking at his computer or his iPad doing Zoom.

But it worked out.

And they had a disciplined campaign, a brilliant campaign, and the rest is history.

- Well, let me ask you a question that others have asked in the past.

Did Donald Trump lose the election, or did Joe Biden win the election, or did COVID-19 determine the election?

- Yes, all three.

(Blanchard laughs) How's that?

(Robert laughs) - Well, I think it's the correct answer.

It's a little bit of everything, isn't it?

- Well, yeah.

I mean, Joe's determination, and the fact that he got... His talent in winning the nomination gave the Democrats a great, I thought, probability of winning the White House.

And so, Governor, we talked a little bit about some of the people around President Biden and Kamala Harris.

You know many of those people who have been nominated talk about some of the high level people who may be moving into government service.

Your Public Service Forum really is to promote and generate interest in people in public service.

And it's good to have high quality people willing to serve, following this Trump administration, you know, drain the swamp kind of attitude.

- Yeah.

Well, that's right.

You know, first, I should mention, that I do know Kamala Harris, not well, but I know her husband quite well.

He's been a law partner of mine, Doug Emhoff.

So he's havin' the time of his life.

And he's a litigator, a trial lawyer, and he does entertainment law.

You know, he was in our Los Angeles office.

But then, after Kamala got elected to the Senate, we gave him an office in Washington.

So he was about four doors from me.

So we talked politics a lot, and he knew I was an original Biden supporter, but he also knew that I thought Kamala was great.

So I've communicated with him since then.

So I'm happy about it.

I'm really happy about that.

The nominee for Secretary of State, Tony Blinken, I know him, not well.

He's really talented.

Actually, I know his father and his uncle.

We all serve as ambassadors together.

Obviously, Secretary of Energy, Jennifer Granholm, she's worked for this for about 10 years, and she will do a great job, and it can really be beneficial to Michigan, particularly, as we promote electric vehicles, and all the jobs related to renewable energy.

President-elect Biden is trying to marry climate change with jobs.

And so Jennifer will be one of those working on that.

She's really excited about it.

There are others.

The Director of the Budget, Neera Tanden, is somebody I've worked with.

She is brilliant.

She will do a great job.

I don't know Janet Yellen, who will be the Secretary of Treasury, but everybody's happy with their economic policies, which I think will be, again, good for the middle class.

Good for average people.

That's really important.

It's a very good group of people he's appointed.

Obviously, I know Tom Vilsack, Secretary of Agriculture.

As Debbie Stabenow will tell you, who's now gonna be chair of the Agriculture Committee in Congress, she and Vilsack could do a lot for rural Michigan, and agriculture in Michigan, which is a major industry in Michigan.

A lot of people don't know that.

But it's a very talented group of people.

Ron Klain, Chief of Staff in the White House.

There's a lot of others that I've known off and on for a long time.

I'm really happy with the team he has, and it's gonna serve America well.

- Pete Buttigieg, at transportation, was very impressive during the campaign.

- Yes.

And the good news for us is, he was mayor of South Bend, just south of our border.

So we're gonna make sure... And his husband is in Traverse city.

So we're gonna make sure that he pays special attention to Michigan.

We're gonna make sure of that.

And I'm sure Jennifer Granholm will remind him of that, probably on a daily basis.

(Robert chuckles) - Well, Governor, you talked about getting tickets and going to the inauguration.

How many inaugurations have you been to, and what are you looking for?

This is going to be a very, very unique year.

- Boy, yeah.

Well, it'd be my 12th in-person.

And I've watched... Of course, as a kid, I watched Eisenhower's inauguration on TV.

And obviously, Kennedy's, I was thrilled as a college student at Michigan State.

This will be my 12th.

And the first, actually was in-person with Jimmy Carter, which was really exciting.

And after the swearing in ceremonies and all that, they normally have a luncheon in the Capitol, which they did.

And President Carter then had a reception for members of Congress.

He could be remote in some respects.

I don't think he really liked politics.

It's interesting.

Or the rough and tumble.

But he, in his own way, loved people, and he really hit the spot with the wives of all the members.

That was my first.

I was disappointed that Ronald Reagan won.

His inauguration was the warmest.

We sat outside.

We didn't even need coats.

It had to be in the low 60s.

We're talking January.

(Robert laughs) That was the warmest.

Four years later, I'm now governor of Michigan.

Coming in for the inauguration, it was the coldest on record.

They canceled the outdoor inauguration.

It was done inside the Capitol Rotunda.

Really amazing.

And, of course, with Clinton, being a colleague and close friend, that was so exciting.

So I'm looking forward to this.

I hope it's not too cold.

There'll be enormous amount of security.

But you know what?

There's always security at inaugurate always.

I mean, you had to go through metal detectors before.

Probably will give us a temperature check this time as well.

We'll be socially distanced.

And you see a who's who there, although, they'll cut back on it now.

So there'll be very few reserved seats.

- And we will hear a different speech from Joe Biden than we heard from Donald Trump.

I remember the Trump inauguration speech was often insulting to many of the people on the DS.

It was really quite unbelievable.

I can't say that he started bad, as badly as he's ending.

But is certainly is true, it was a very unusual speech.

And do you think that as Joe gets going with his inaugural speech, it'll be a speech of unity, and direction, and we'll see a lot of activities in the first 100 days of his presidency?

- Well, I agree with all that.

Yes, Joe Biden is gonna give an inspirational speech.

I'm sure he will inspire.

It'll be a call to unity.

And I believe it will be a very active first hundred days, without a doubt.

And they're getting ready for this.

He's got a strong team.

They're getting ready.

The two major issues, of course, are getting COVID-19 under control, so we can improve the health of our people, and getting the economy restarted.

As he says, "Build back better economy and jobs".

Those are the two big ones.

But related to that, is climate change, dealing with that, and renewable energy, and healing the wounds between the races and ethnic groups.

There's been...

The previous administration has yet targeted in that sense.

The African-American community and the Latino community targeted them for very poor treatment, and really, criticism, and divided everybody, and inspired those sort of white nationalists.

You're not gonna, obviously, see any of that with Joe.

It's a call of unity.

The people are already warming up.

People that didn't vote for Joe Biden, they're already warming up to him.

They are.

And he's getting high marks for the transition.

So I think that group will expand as time goes on, but it's gonna take a lot of work.

It won't happen overnight.

It will not happen overnight.

There are gonna be fits and starts.

There'll be failures and successes.

But a guy like Joe has lived with all of that.

He's lived with that for 48 years.

His election, in some respects, is one of the most inspirational personal stories of anyone who ever went into politics.

It's an example of a guy who wanted to lead, who wanted to serve, who had been inspired by others, like President Kennedy, who hung in there.

He ran, he served, he ran, he served.

He wanted to be president in 1988.

That fell through.

He got pushed down, some respects, made fun of.

He picked himself up.

He survived.

He persevered.

It is a triumph of hope, and energy, and determination.

I've never seen anything like it.

And what's beautiful about it is, at this time, in his age, he's my age, he's the wisest guy who sought this office in generations.

Thank God for that.

We need that.

What a story!

It's a celebration of the American dream that all of us can witness and enjoy, and now be led by.

I'm just so excited!

Can tell, it's just an amazing story.

- Well, and I think, for most people, as we lived through the Trump presidency, the world was shocked by his aggressive language that he used.

You can debate policy all you want, but the aggressive language that the president used during his service was a shock to the world.

And I think Joe Biden will bring a sense of calm to markets and to nations.

Do you really anticipate that will happen?

- Well, it already has, Bob.

It already has.

During the debate, (Blanchard laughs) Mr. Trump said, "If he's elected, the stock market will crash".

Well, what happened was, Joe Biden won, and the stock market surged.

I don't view the stock market as the measure of a society's health.

It's a measure of the investment, investor class of health, perhaps, financial health, but it doesn't have a lot to do with the actual physical health of our people, or their opportunities, or hopes, or dreams of their actual down to Earth jobs and family.

So that's what Joe is gonna worry about, and I'm just optimistic about it.

There's a lot to be done here.

I mean, all the small businesses that have been ruined, all the people who were laid off, the state and local budgets have been decimated because they've lost tax revenue.

They've lost income tax revenue, corporate tax revenue, sales tax revenue, gas tax revenue.

And so the states and local units are the ones that hire the police, the fire, the teachers, the essential services.

They're gonna need a rescue, and Joe Biden is gonna, I'm sure with the support of Congress, will provide that.

We're not gonna have an economic recovery if the state and local communities are all laying off people because their budgets have been decimated.

So we have an enormous amount of work to do.

We have to heal the spirit of our country, but also, physically get, as I said, the disease under control, and get the economy jump started.

It's a tall order.

And look at our governor, Whitmer, what she's dealt with.

My god!

And, of course, I admire her, and was proud to support her.

But when I was governor, we inherited a terrible financial crisis, and 17% unemployment, and we've dealt with it successfully in the first couple years, but I didn't have a health...

I didn't have a virus.

I didn't have floods all at the same time, and racial strife.

Although, it's been minimal in Michigan.

But at least nationally, you know, the divisions that have been stoked by the George Floyd tragedy are real, and most people know it, and they wanna deal with it.

So Gretchen is trying to lead our state in the middle of all that, while people show up with assault weapons in our Capitol, which should not be allowed, and nooses outside, Confederate flags.

And now, only one Republican in Lansing spoke out against it.

Not one natural Republic spoke out against that April 30th storming the Capitol, And I think that gave a green light to those groups to do that in Washington DC, and some of them came here for that.

So hats off to Gretchen as she's trying to do with all these things.

Hats off to her and the people there helping her, and I am too, and so is Janet.

She's gotta deal with all these things, too.

And Joe's gonna be a great partner for her.

They really bonded during the campaign.

And she was on his short list to be vice president, and that was real.

That was not promotional.

It was real.

And so they're very close.

That's gonna help us as well.

I mean, Joe would help Michigan anyway, but he's gonna be especially sensitive when Gretchen Whitmer calls him on the line.

That's another good benefit here.

- Governor, we've enjoyed a great conversation here, but we also solicited questions from some of the fans and supporters of the forum, and I wanna get to as many as possible.

Here's a question.

As ambassador to Canada, what's an interesting story you can tell?

Give us a Canada story.

- Well, I loved the job.

Being ambassador to Canada is one of the best jobs on the planet.

And a lot of my friends, when they heard how much I enjoyed it, they all wanted it.

They've all lined up to try to get it now from Joe Biden or Barack Obama.

It's a wonderful combination of foreign and domestic issues, and we've made friendships forever.

I will tell you that, one of my favorites, of course, is the prime minister that I serve with, Jean Chrétien.

And he is, again, one the...

He's very much like Biden.

One of the most durable, successful politicians in Canadian history.

He'd had like 13 different cabinet positions before he became prime minister.

He was calling me during the election.

I mean, you're talin' about, I left there in the spring of '96, but here's the prime, or calling me up to ask me, is it gonna be all right?

Are you gonna carry Michigan?

He loves Joe.

He knows Joe.

The current prime minister, Trudeau, had a dinner for Joe that I attended.

So they're calling me.

The prime minister, his chief of staff, his communication director, his campaign manager, all calling me all fall to assure them that we were gonna carry Michigan, because they knew that would be a bellwether.

And happy, happy, happy.

Now, there are a lot of interesting things that happened in Canada that I can't really repeat, to be honest.

I did write a book called "Behind the Embassy Door".

"Behind the Embassy Door", remember that.

You can get it on Amazon for probably about 35 cents.

But- - I think it's...

I think it's right behind me up here on my bookshelf.

A great book.

- I've got- - I recommend it.

- I've got it behind me, if you look over right there.

That's it.

Anyway, one thing that was humorous but sad was, Prime Minister Yitzhak Rabin was tragically assassinated in Israel, and it was a tragedy for the whole world, a tragedy for the Middle East peace process.

It really was, because he was trying to put together some sort of rapprochement with the Palestinian organizations, and had been somewhat successful in the Oslo Accords.

He was assassinated, and so all the different world leaders were going to the funeral in Israel.

And so Prime Minister Chrétien was...

They were all packed up to go, and they went to bed, and his wife, Aline, got up a little early, 'cause she heard some rustling.

And she thought, goodness, it's a little early for our staff to show up to help prepare the final packing.

And so she opened their bedroom door, and she saw a guy walking toward her with a knife.

She slammed the door, woke up the prime minister.

Jean, Jean, there's somebody out here with a knife!

Jean, get up, get up!

He got up, and they don't have any firearms in their bedroom.

He grabbed a gigantic piece of Inuit art.

If you've ever seen it... We have a wonderful collection.

He grabbed the piece of Inuit art, and stood behind the door in the case guy...

He was banging on the...

In case the guy was trying to break in.

With his Intuit art, and he talks about it now laughingly, 'cause they didn't know what was going on, finally, they called the security.

Finally, the security arrived.

They had a whole guard shack out front, but apparently, it took him time to because he lost the keys to the house.

(Blanchard laughs) I had better security in my house as ambassador than this guy did as prime minister of Canada.

So they grabbed the guy.

He sat down, and was forlorn, dropped his knife.

And so to hear the prime minister talk about how he's standing back there with this piece of Inuit art, and Aline saying, "Don't let him in, don't let him in!

", it's quite a story.

I wrote about it in my book.

And I don't think the art, the Royal Canadian Mounted Police, RCMP liked my exposing them, but I wanted to write the truth, and that should never have ever happened.

But what a fun guy Jean Chrétien is.

I mean, I was out golfing with him once, and I'm a terrible golfer, as you know, Bob.

And you and I are about equivalent on that.

And he's good golfer.

- You like to play with me because you're better.

(Robert laughs) - So I'm trying to do a chip shot on to the green, and it goes wayward on me.

It also becomes a line drive.

It's gonna go way over the green.

He's standing here.

He takes his hat off, and catches the ball, and then drops it by the hole.

Now that's the kinda good guy Prime Minister Jean Chrétien was in Canada, and he became a close friend of Bill Clinton's.

We had great, great times.

I love the guy, and he loves us, and he loves Joe Biden, and cared enough to keep calling and worrying.

So worried about our country.

Most of the Canadians have been deeply, deeply troubled about what's goin' on here, and they're now hopeful for the future, as are most countries- - But it's been- - It's been a rocky relationship between Prime Minister Trudeau and President Trump.

Can that be repaired?

- Sure.

- With Joe Biden?

- Yes.

Of course.

They know him.

They like him.

He like them.

About a month before the Biden/Obama administration left office, Prime Minister Justin Trudeau had a dinner honoring Joe Biden, and a lot of us were there.

I was there.

And so that's Joe's last memory of Canada, was this wonderful dinner, where everybody cheered, and cheered, and cheered him, and he gave a wonderful speech, and there were four prime ministers, both parties.

So yeah, I think...

The theatrics that went on between the White House and Canada were totally unnecessary.

It was just ridiculous.

The problem is, if you don't fawn in front of Mr. Trump, then you're somehow the enemy.

So they actually issued a tariff saying, steel from Canada, and aluminum from Canada is a national threat, is a threat to our national security.

Nobody believes that!

That's absurd.

They wanted to modernize NAFTA, which was a good idea, but they spent a year with cheap theatrics, when they could've had a smooth adoption of a modernized NAFTA probably a year earlier.

So people in the White House said, that there's a dark place in hell for Prime Minister Trudeau.

This kinda rhetoric, they lash out everybody, you know?

They lashed out at Angela Merkel, who, really, frankly, has held up the Western alliance these years.

So all that is calmed down.

We'll have some disagreements with Canada over a few trade issues here and there.

Right now, we have to get COVID under control together, and make sure we can cross the border at some point.

Right now, only essential services can go back and forth, like healthcare, auto supply chains, things like that that are really important.

I will say, my favorite project is the Gordie Howe International Bridge between Detroit and Windsor.

That will be the most important infrastructure project, is the most important infrastructure project in North America.

That construction on that has continued.

But we work with Canada on every issue.

You name it, everything.

So it's not just trade and alien smuggling.

You know, it's the Great Lakes.

We were founders of the United Nations, of NATO.

We're partners in NORAD.

We're gonna deal with climate change.

Actually, the warming of the Arctic.

There's so many issues we work with them on a daily basis.

And generally, our different departments and agencies have a very good relationship with their counterparts in Canada.

They're dealing with them almost on a daily basis.

At the top, the tone was terrible by the current White House.

But the rank and file agencies, and civil servants, and foreign service still had good relations with Canada, and that will continue now with a strong pro-Canada leader, like Joe Biden.

- Well, Governor, we're coming down to our final few minutes.

We have a lot of great questions that have come in for you.

One of the things that came in, and I don't mean to press you, but I think it's a good, serious question for this forum.

How will the Biden administration really respond, react, cope with what will be, no doubt, some criminal investigations post-Trump presidency?

What are your thoughts?

- Well, they will not interfere.

Prompt, support, suggest, instigate any prosecutions against anybody.

The Justice Department will be now ably led by Merrick Garland, will make its own independent judgements based on the decision and wisdom of career professionals.

And so Joe Biden won't get near that, period.

- Governor, in the final few minutes, take some time, and tell your fans, friends, audience, anything you want moving forward.

Any sort of final thoughts as we wrap up this conversation.

It's terrific.

We talk all the time.

I'm not sure that the audience gets to hear you download on so many things.

You've been so involved in the campaign, and likely will be moving forward.

What do you think people need to hear, or want to hear, that you'd like to share?

- Well, that's... (Blanchard laughs) Everybody who knows me knows I could talk forever.

So I don't know what to say, other than, I wanna say, number one, we're gonna continue our Public Service Forum for many years.

I have, in addition to endowing, (mumbles) forum.

We do have access to a lot of people that we can recruit to come as speakers.

I didn't even mention that, some of the authors that we had, like Evan Thomas and Cokie Roberts.

But we're gonna have authors, as well as public figures.

We'd be interested in people letting us know their suggestions on who they'd like me to post.

I can usually get them.

That's one of the advantages of having been around as many years as I have been.

But I would suggest you pick people that you think not only what you would like, but you think others would like, including students and the community.

So we're gonna continue that, and we're happy about how it's worked out.

I shouldn't say, I'm also a chairman of the National Archives Foundation.

You alluded to that briefly.

But I do have access, again, to all those historians.

What I read for pleasure is non-fiction, generally history and politics, and so that's one of my passions.

I probably could have been a history teacher had I not gone into law and politics.

But I'm looking ahead.

You know, I'm an optimist.

I was raised by a single parent mom with very good advice from my sister, my older sister, Suzanne, who always gave me good advice in my campaigns and my efforts, and my wonderful brother-in-law, Bob Brooke.

They've just been wonderful to me, as part of the family, somewhat, that Suzanne and I never had growing up.

So, you know, if someone had told me, that as a kid, you know, I dreamed of going into politics.

My mother was a big admirer of Franklin Roosevelt, and especially Eleanor Roosevelt, so that made her a real liberal on civil rights, on human rights, on peace.

And so, you know, if...

So I wanted to be a congressman from the time I was 14-years-old.

When I figured out that I wasn't gonna be right fielder for the Detroit Tigers, succeeding Al Kayline, I turned my attention to politics.

And if somebody told me, that I would grow up, and become a congressman, (Blanchard sighs loudly) governor, ambassador all by age 50, I would have thought, I had died and gone to heaven.

So I feel I owe our country, our people, the people on this show, on this program, a great deal more of service, which is why I'm so proud I supported Joe Biden, and Kamala Harris, and their team.

I'm looking forward.

I'm an optimist.

The glass is still have full for me, no matter what happens.

Joe Biden is gonna be a very special leader.

Some people think because he's older, he will be a transitional president.

No, he'll be more than that.

He will be the founding president of the new revitalize United States of America, the America we've always known and cherished, and yes, you will help us, with our support, restore the soul of America.

Thank you.

- Michigan governor, Jim Blanchard, former congressman, ambassador, and certainly, the creator of the Blanchard Public Service Forum here at Michigan State.

I'm Robert Kolt, a Professor of Practice in the Department of Advertising and Public Relations in the College of Communication Arts and Sciences.

We thank the college.

We thank all of our friends at WKAR for facilitating this conversation.

In particular, our organizers and supporters.

Alex Tripp and Sparky Mallory, you have, again, done a terrific job in arranging this event.

- Yeah.

- WKAR, we sincerely appreciate all of your technical work in making this happen for all of the supporters and friends.

And we will be back.

The Blanchard Public Service Forum will be back in-person soon.

We'll move through the COVID-19 crisis.

But we will be back together, enjoying the high level of people coming and sharing their experience and knowledge at Michigan State University.

(triumphant instrumental music)