We're back now in Studio C with Secretary of State Jocelyn Benson.

At the moment, the Duggan announced he was running is in a independent.

What was your first thought?

I was actually on the phone working on some lame duck policy issues like the Michigan Voting Rights Act and what are we going to do about unemployment and making sure that we are getting through the transparency initiatives that we need to shine a light on what's happening in Lansing?

So I sort of looked up and then went back to work and didn't faze you in the least know nothing does.

Come on, my military family.

I just keep marching forward.

But it's, you know, to me, I think this is a momen where we need to be firefighters putting out fires, not running away from from things we see as maybe, you know, on fire.

And that's who I am.

And so if there was any reaction, it's you know, this makes me even more committed and dedicated to making sure that we the Party of the Voting Rights Act, the party of the people continue to better communicate to our residents in Michiganders everywhere that that's who we are and that we're on their side.

And I think this this potentially does increase the importance of doing that work.

But we had to do it anyway no matter what.

If you run away from a fire, sometimes you live, but when you go into a fir with a hose and put out the fire and build back, better, you can not just live and survive, but help other people live and survive as well.

What was the secretary of state of Michigan working on unemployment policy?

Well, I am also a resident of the state of Michigan and care very much about that issue and but to specifically what happened, actually.

Yeah, I'll tell you what happened.

So I, I, I'm a former military spouse and have close ties to that community.

And it was a woman who I worked with o the military spouses of Michigan who reached out to me out of nowhere named Liz.

And she said, did you know unemployment hasn't been raised since the 1990s?

And I think she was struggling, needing meeting with her family member.

And she said, is there anything being done about this?

And I said, Actually, there is a bill right now.

And so I reached ou to some folks in the legislature and connected them because I said, you should know that these are folks who aren't politica paying attention to the politics but are feeling the pain.

And these are the types of voices you need to hear right now.

And in addition to those lame duck issues you mentioned, what's your confidence leve that any of this will be able to happen in the next two weeks?

We've seen some attendance issues plaguing the House Democrats.

Is it possible to ge some of those priorities done?

You know, every single person who is elected to represent the people of Michigan needs to show up for work if they're able to in this moment and make sure they're getting done the work of the people.

That's what's happening right now.

We call it lame duck.

We know it' sort of the end of the session, but that makes it, in my view, even more important that we move the ball forward on things that may have been stalled over the last several months and actually get things done, get things to the governor's desk so that we can show results both not just as a part but as as leaders in the state.

So I'm hopeful.

I think we're seeing a lot of that activity certainly this week.

We'll se what happens in the days ahead.

I feel good about everything.

But again, there's lots o lots of people in the mix here.

And the important thing is that everyone recognizes that in this moment we've got to show up for the people of Michigan.

I've heard you say a lot today, You know, you're listening.

You're talking to people.

You know, you hear hear what people are saying.

But to me, you know, tha kind of sounds like politician talk a little bit.

You've been, you know, in thi position for years now, I guess.

You know I heard Kamala Harris say a lot.

You know, we're listening to people.

Do you really think that' what people want or do you want you know, do you think it's more the messaging?

It's you know, can you explain maybe what that means of just listening I guess?

I think it's about making sure people kno they're heard and feel they're heard and see that they're heard in the actions that we take.

And after we listen.

I don't think people think they're heard.

Don't you think people want to hear what politicians have to say?

Both.

I mean, I think it's a conversation.

I mean, that's what makes me representation is it's listening, saying it's meeting people where they are saying how can we do things better for coming forth with their own data driven solutions or other types of best practices.

And that's what we've done in this office reforming customer service, increasing access to and the security of our democracy coming forward and say, here's some proposals.

What do you think of them?

It's a it's a it's a relationship.

Representation is, leadership is.

And that's really why it's so important for me that we up in all communities, not just those that are that are that vote Democratic or are purple, to me, it's just as important that someone in Hillsdale, in Livonia or in Grand Rapids or Muskegon or Benton Harbor has has a good as interaction with our office as someone in the Upper Peninsula in Traverse City or in Alpena or anywhere else.

So to me, listenin is about showing up for people, meeting people where they are responding to what they need and showing them that government can actually work for for everyone, no matter who you are, where you live.

Or he vote for secretary.

This week in the Michigan House, there was a bill introduced that would eliminate as as counting as gifts to legislators, tickets to charity events.

And it looks like on the surface that they wan to make basically exempt tickets that lobbyists buy to send lawmakers to the auto prom.

The charity preview at the auto show.

What do you think of that of that proposal?

First, our goal, our sort of, you know, centerpiece or our gold star needs to be our Nort Star needs to be transparency.

That's important.

Things need to be disclosed.

And right now, a lot of stuff is happening that's not disclosed.

So my priority is that piece.

Secondly, though, there are there are there are arguments to be made.

And this is why in other states or at the federal level, these types of things are allowed that when you're having a charity event, you want to have people who are decision makers in the state show u and there's some value to that.

And so that I think is part of the conversation that people are having right now.

It's a little bit differen than just getting a free ticket to a sporting event where you get to show up and perhaps be persuaded to, you know, make a decision that would favor, you know, as someone as opposed to the people you represent.

So I think that conversation is there is there a delineation there?

And certainly other states and at the federal level, they hav they have found there to be one.

And I think that's an important conversation to have.

My view again is transparency has got to rule the day.

People have to be informed, and then we have to make sur that there's accountability and and and procedures in place to to and if people do violate the laws in place, actually see accountability and justice.

If you accept some of this big dark money, I do not have a C4 and I won't.

It is important to me that everyone running for office in this state is transparent about where they're getting their funding from.

And at the same time, it's important to me that any money spen to influence political activity or policymaking in the state is disclosed.

Have you been approached by those folks to say, let us give you a check?

No, actually, I mean, perhaps over the because I'm I want to answer that question accurately.

And there may have been a time I mean, I've been in office for a long time.

And so I'm sure there were times where people said nothing.

And I mean, there have been times where people have said, hey, you know, we need this to get done.

And, you know, by the way, is there is there a charity that we can write?

You know, is there a C4 that you have it kind of makes the hair stand up on the back of my neck when that type of thing happens and reveals to me just how much we've got to do to address a culture of corruption in Lansing.

Why do Democrats in the House seem not to hav the same appetite that you have?

That's a question for them.

But I've actually seen a lot of Democrats that have said when I've asked that, I've actually seen a lot of Democrats.

You know, Betsy Coffia is a great example of someone who's really.

That's one.

I mean, the Bright Act has a lot of support in the Senate and the House on both sides of the aisle.

So I actually think there are a lot of lawmakers who recognize the importance of transparency and ethical government and want Michigan to go from being ranked last to being ranked first.

It's why you're seeing this conversation happen.

It's also why you're seeing a lot of work to move the FOIA expansion forward, which is passed.

The Senate now is up for a vote in the House, so it's not for lack of trying, but you know, the work will continue.

And I think in my view, the citizens of Michigan need to also reach out to their lawmakers and say, if you want transparency, you know, we've got to fight for it together.

And that's when we've seen that happen.

We actually can see the needle move.

In this charity ticket example.

What's the difference between Ford Motor Company buying the entire legislature tickets to the to the charity preview and Ford Motor Compan putting every lawmaker in one of their suites at Ford Field for its Lions football team.

The access is same, is it not?

Well, no.

I think there's that's two different scenarios, two different audiences.

When you have people showing up to a charity preview where you want to, you know, demonstrate to other who are showing up there, too, that they can have conversations with lawmakers and they can have, you know, access.

And in that way, the public can have access to their representatives, which is oftentime what those scenarios are about.

With it, with the first example, it's a little bit different than just giving someone a ticket to a game in which they can have a lot of fun and get access themselves as lawmakers do something that they otherwise a perk that otherwise might not have come to them.

And so I d think it's two different things.

And that's again, why we're having or why lawmaker are having these conversations right now, Ford's access to them.

I mean, if Ford wants to lobb them, put them on their showroom right in front of their F-150 and say, hey, we you know, this is what we're doing, and we could use your support for this new tax incentive.

You look at someone who's gone to the auto show in the past, many times, even prior to serving as secretary of state, I've seen the benefit from a policymaking standpoint, from a decision making standpoint of of of meeting people where they are, whether they be employers in the state or citizens of the state, and hearing about what they need.

It's a little bit different than going to a football game and just, you know, being there to, you know, we all love football games and watching the Lions win right now.

Sure.

But in that case, there's there's very little policy benefit to that type of scenario as there might be, too.

With charity preview.

The next test of quickly Yeah the next test of where you know what the party learned from 2024 is going to be you know the state or the party chair races both the state and for the DNC.

Do you have a certain candidate that you think you know?

I know there's still names being tossed out, but you would like to see maybe both run the state or, you know, the national party?

I think whoever it is at the state or federal level or national level.

We need someone who is dynamic, who is energetic, who's willing to shake things u a little bit and and reexamine things may not seem broken, but needs to be fixed anyway.

And that type of innovative spiri and is is something that I think would be great for our party at the at the state level as well as at the national level, someon who's who certainly cares about the issues that we as Democrats stand for of of of protecting people in the workplace, protecting our kids in schools making sure women and everyone have access to quality healt care and reproductive freedom.

All of that is still going to be important as continue to have to be importan to our party and those leaders who can best help us reac people and communicate to them that we're on their side, that we're going to work to make their lives better.

We're going to work to save them time and money.

That's the type of leadership that that I believe is is is in our party and that we'd love to see continue to lead in our party.

Madam Secretary, good to see you.

Thanks for being on OTR.

Thanks for having me.